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Question: What about dual 6.6 vacuum motors for the Goliath? I understand , in this way what about the proper work of heat exchanger , does it make a sense with two motors heat exchanger unit?
And what do you think this configuration with two motors will overall outperform the regular 4 motors or not ?
Does this two motors will generate enought heat like the other four?
Regards Answer: The total vacuum of 4 motor out performs the larger two of the 6.6. The heat on the two 6.6 will not be as good either. We have tested a lot of vacuum motor configurations in the last 30 years and find that this configuration works the best in overall cfm, inches of lift and heat performance. Though the formula of max inches of lift X (times) Max cfm = vacuum units numbers are close.
Goliath is 42,500 and Cross American is 35,000.
This is less than a 18% difference. What we have no way of knowing is how machine work in "use cfm" because once the lip of the wand hits the damp carpet we cannot test the cfm coming out of the machine. I am also sure these changes based on they fiber type, size of jets, width of wand path, speed of stroke, fiber denier, pile ounce weight, soil type and mass... The Goliath also is going to use about an extra 3 amps of power per power cord. The air out of the Goliath is 180 degree F and the air out of the 6.6 is 140 degrees F. Being that power consumption is a direct per portion to cleaning efficiency also leaves me to believe that it is transferring more energy to the cleaning process.
We also stock the cross American 6.6 machine if you want a standard stock 6.6 configuration.
Question: What about if you build Goliath with 3 stage motors - is that possible?
Answer: No it is not possible because the motors are too tall to easily fit with 4 motors. They only fit with two motors. Also two 2 stage motors at 15 amps @ 115 volts or 7.5 amps @ 230 volts out perform 2 three stage motors at 10 amps @ 115 volts or 5 amps @ 230 volts. Even if we made the Goliath taller to fit 3 stage motors are you willing to plug in 4 power cords just to run the vacuum? The entire design is surrounded by the maximum performance in vacuum, cfm, heat, amp draw, number of power cords. You will not be able to come up up with a different layout because all possible layouts have already been considered.
Question: Can the Gliath portable be custom built with 2 three stage vacs paired with 2 two stage vacs? (10 stage total)
along with the stainless pumpout, and a direct feed 800psi pump? would this be 3 power cords or 4?
10k generator enough to run this?
thank you
Answer: There are 3 stage vacuum motors that run on 7.5 amps. If you look at the US Products Pex 500 they place both 3 stage vacuum motors on one power cord and only draw 15 amps on the cord. Just because it is 3 stage does not always mean that it is a better motor. Usually it does but not always. The Pex 500 vacuum performs exactly the same as a dual 2 stage vacuum. They use the dual 3 stage as a marketing statement for the customer that do not know any better. The flip side of this is true. If you look at the vacuum motors used on Velocity Technologies truckmount, these are only 2 stage vacuum motors but the for vacuum motors draws almost 45 amps. This is 50% more than the 30 amp draw for the Goliath four two stage vacuum motors. It is all about amp draw. The more energy you turn into vacuum usually means better performance. Power consumption is in direct relation of cleaning performance. Machines that consume more power usually clean better than those that use less power. The VT HybridTM is only 8 stages of vacuum and the vacuum is super impressive. So now let look at your question. The Goliath already draws 15 amps per cord to run two vacuum motors. Then we add a 3.5 amp pressure pump on one cord and a 3.5 amp auto dump pump on the other power cord. So the machine is already at 18.5 amps per cord if all 6 items are running at the same time. You want us to remove a 2 stage vacuum motors and replace it with a 3 stage vacuum motors. Are we looking to change it out with another 7.5 amp 3 stage or maybe a 2 stage that draws 10 or 13 amps, or a 3 stage that draws 10 or 13 amps? Why not just purchase the HybridTM that is already 45 amp draw vacuum? Or just consider a vacuum booster that is also a dual 2 stage series system and place it on the Goliath? This will provide the extra 100 cfm and also raise your "use inches of lift" as the wand is stroking the carpet. Now to answer your 10K generator question? I do not know. You have to add up all your amp draw and make sure you add at least 10% for the generator. Please remember that most (if not all) generator manufactures lie about generator output. This means that if I purchase a car and it can drive 140 miles and hour, and I drive it 140 mile per hour 100% of the time, how long is my car going to last? If I drive it 70 mile and hour I know it will last a long time. This is true with pumps and generators. Take for example a Pumptec pump 205V that is rated for 800 psi and market my carpet cleaning machine as an 800 psi tile cleaning machine and then install a motor on the pump that is really only rated for 500 psi but will push the pump to 800 psi for short job times frames but is severely shortening the life span of my pump head and motor. Do I market my carpet cleaning machine as being an 800 psi tile cleaning machine to un-suspecting cleaners or do you market it as a 500 psi machine? All 500 psi carpet cleaning machines can be turned up to 800 psi for they all have the same Pumptec 204V, 205V, or 207V 800 psi pump head installed but this is not a recommended pressure to run the machine.
So if you check with Pumptec you will find to run a true 800 psi, you will need a 356 series head and a larger 1or 1.5 horse power motor. Like what you see on the Water Otter.
Same is true with generators. Look at the surge rating. In a perfect world you would want to run the generator at half of its surge rating. But because this would be an expensive generator, people are going to purchase the generator to the limit and run it "140 miles per hour all the time." So if your combined system ends up being 9000 watts, do you really want to try to stuff it on a 10,000 watt surge generator? What do you want to do? I am sure you can but I do not have enough information about your wattage to tell you if this is a good idea.
So here is what you could do. We already port the Goliath flood pumper with an extra port on the machine for a vacuum booster. You can purchase a vacuum booster, generator, maybe have use provide a heat exchanger for the generator, purchase a pressure washing pump. Again this sounds like a VTech Hybrid TM to me already done but you could purchase all the components and do it yourself.
And what do you think this configuration with two motors will overall outperform the regular 4 motors or not ?
Does this two motors will generate enought heat like the other four?
Regards Answer: The total vacuum of 4 motor out performs the larger two of the 6.6. The heat on the two 6.6 will not be as good either. We have tested a lot of vacuum motor configurations in the last 30 years and find that this configuration works the best in overall cfm, inches of lift and heat performance. Though the formula of max inches of lift X (times) Max cfm = vacuum units numbers are close.
Goliath is 42,500 and Cross American is 35,000.
This is less than a 18% difference. What we have no way of knowing is how machine work in "use cfm" because once the lip of the wand hits the damp carpet we cannot test the cfm coming out of the machine. I am also sure these changes based on they fiber type, size of jets, width of wand path, speed of stroke, fiber denier, pile ounce weight, soil type and mass... The Goliath also is going to use about an extra 3 amps of power per power cord. The air out of the Goliath is 180 degree F and the air out of the 6.6 is 140 degrees F. Being that power consumption is a direct per portion to cleaning efficiency also leaves me to believe that it is transferring more energy to the cleaning process.
We also stock the cross American 6.6 machine if you want a standard stock 6.6 configuration.
Question: What about if you build Goliath with 3 stage motors - is that possible?
Answer: No it is not possible because the motors are too tall to easily fit with 4 motors. They only fit with two motors. Also two 2 stage motors at 15 amps @ 115 volts or 7.5 amps @ 230 volts out perform 2 three stage motors at 10 amps @ 115 volts or 5 amps @ 230 volts. Even if we made the Goliath taller to fit 3 stage motors are you willing to plug in 4 power cords just to run the vacuum? The entire design is surrounded by the maximum performance in vacuum, cfm, heat, amp draw, number of power cords. You will not be able to come up up with a different layout because all possible layouts have already been considered.
Question: Can the Gliath portable be custom built with 2 three stage vacs paired with 2 two stage vacs? (10 stage total)
along with the stainless pumpout, and a direct feed 800psi pump? would this be 3 power cords or 4?
10k generator enough to run this?
thank you
Answer: There are 3 stage vacuum motors that run on 7.5 amps. If you look at the US Products Pex 500 they place both 3 stage vacuum motors on one power cord and only draw 15 amps on the cord. Just because it is 3 stage does not always mean that it is a better motor. Usually it does but not always. The Pex 500 vacuum performs exactly the same as a dual 2 stage vacuum. They use the dual 3 stage as a marketing statement for the customer that do not know any better. The flip side of this is true. If you look at the vacuum motors used on Velocity Technologies truckmount, these are only 2 stage vacuum motors but the for vacuum motors draws almost 45 amps. This is 50% more than the 30 amp draw for the Goliath four two stage vacuum motors. It is all about amp draw. The more energy you turn into vacuum usually means better performance. Power consumption is in direct relation of cleaning performance. Machines that consume more power usually clean better than those that use less power. The VT HybridTM is only 8 stages of vacuum and the vacuum is super impressive. So now let look at your question. The Goliath already draws 15 amps per cord to run two vacuum motors. Then we add a 3.5 amp pressure pump on one cord and a 3.5 amp auto dump pump on the other power cord. So the machine is already at 18.5 amps per cord if all 6 items are running at the same time. You want us to remove a 2 stage vacuum motors and replace it with a 3 stage vacuum motors. Are we looking to change it out with another 7.5 amp 3 stage or maybe a 2 stage that draws 10 or 13 amps, or a 3 stage that draws 10 or 13 amps? Why not just purchase the HybridTM that is already 45 amp draw vacuum? Or just consider a vacuum booster that is also a dual 2 stage series system and place it on the Goliath? This will provide the extra 100 cfm and also raise your "use inches of lift" as the wand is stroking the carpet. Now to answer your 10K generator question? I do not know. You have to add up all your amp draw and make sure you add at least 10% for the generator. Please remember that most (if not all) generator manufactures lie about generator output. This means that if I purchase a car and it can drive 140 miles and hour, and I drive it 140 mile per hour 100% of the time, how long is my car going to last? If I drive it 70 mile and hour I know it will last a long time. This is true with pumps and generators. Take for example a Pumptec pump 205V that is rated for 800 psi and market my carpet cleaning machine as an 800 psi tile cleaning machine and then install a motor on the pump that is really only rated for 500 psi but will push the pump to 800 psi for short job times frames but is severely shortening the life span of my pump head and motor. Do I market my carpet cleaning machine as being an 800 psi tile cleaning machine to un-suspecting cleaners or do you market it as a 500 psi machine? All 500 psi carpet cleaning machines can be turned up to 800 psi for they all have the same Pumptec 204V, 205V, or 207V 800 psi pump head installed but this is not a recommended pressure to run the machine.
So if you check with Pumptec you will find to run a true 800 psi, you will need a 356 series head and a larger 1or 1.5 horse power motor. Like what you see on the Water Otter.
Same is true with generators. Look at the surge rating. In a perfect world you would want to run the generator at half of its surge rating. But because this would be an expensive generator, people are going to purchase the generator to the limit and run it "140 miles per hour all the time." So if your combined system ends up being 9000 watts, do you really want to try to stuff it on a 10,000 watt surge generator? What do you want to do? I am sure you can but I do not have enough information about your wattage to tell you if this is a good idea.
So here is what you could do. We already port the Goliath flood pumper with an extra port on the machine for a vacuum booster. You can purchase a vacuum booster, generator, maybe have use provide a heat exchanger for the generator, purchase a pressure washing pump. Again this sounds like a VTech Hybrid TM to me already done but you could purchase all the components and do it yourself.